Interview with Carole James

March 5, 2005

Carole James is the leader of the New Democratic Party and Leader of the Loyal Opposition in the province of British Columbia. She is running to unseat Gordon Campbell as Premier of British Columbia in the 2005 Provincial election.

Leader James agreed to sit down to an interview with the Other Press.

OP: First off Leader James I'd like to thank you, on behalf of the Students of Douglas College for agreeing to this interview.

The two biggest concerns for students at Douglas College, and indeed post-secondary students all over BC tend to be twofold:
A) tuition fees, which have been rising considerably, and
B) class availability, which seems to be declining as overcrowding, and overall enrollment continues to rise.

I thought I should open by giving you a chance to state clearly your party's position on these two issues.

JAMES: Thank you. Well I certainly agree with students about the challenges they are facing. I have a daughter who is at fourth year at UVIC and she took a couple of years out and we've seen personally the tuition increases and what impact that has had. So I think it's pretty clear that the Liberals and Gordon Campbell have shown no regard for students and for affordability. New Democrats have already made a commitment to freeze tuition, once again, in '05-'06. We recognize that that's only a first step and that it doesn't address the problem for students because tuition has obviously risen so greatly over the last four years under the Liberals that it's not going to solve everything. But as a first step we've said freeze tuition in '05-'06 and also provide the funding for universities and colleges to cover the rate of inflation so they don't pass those costs on to students. What we saw before is that when you don't provide the funding when you freeze tuition you face additional pressures with additional costs to colleges and universities, and those costs get passed on. So that's the first piece.

The second piece- I think is space is critical and space in communities outside the lower mainland is also critical because for students who have to travel from another community outside the lower mainland to a university or college they have the additional pressure- on top of tuition- of living expenses and all of the other expenses wrapped up in that. So we think it's important to have a comprehensive plan. That's what's been missing, in my opinion, from the Liberals. They said they wanted to address spaces but they haven't provided the funding for them, they haven't provided the tuition for students, and they cut the grant program. So we're saying put a comprehensive plan together, address the issues of affordability for students and address the issues of access.

OP: Many students would obviously like to see a tuition freeze, as you just advocated, but there are also the constant demands for increased funding for all sorts of school programs.
Would raising taxes be the only solution?

JAMES: Well, that's part of the reason we've said you need to increase the funding to colleges and universities to cover the rate of inflation, because that way they've got the money to address the issues and the pressures that they're facing. You also need to ensure that capital dollars are there, for increased spaces to put them in. But I think that kind of approach that we've suggested can actually address the affordability of pressures on colleges and universities for funding.

OP: Ideologically, how do you define yourself? What views are the foundation for your political beliefs?

JAMES: Well that's interesting. You get into that debate and people want to know if you're "more left" or are you "more right" or are you more "in the middle." I've described myself most of my life as a pretty practical person. I'm a pretty moderate person. I think I'm a pragmatic kind of person. I look at the issues and I look at how we can get to where we go. I'm pretty common-sense and that's kind of the approach I've taken my whole life in leadership positions. People can define me in different kinds of ways but I think, as I've said, I would describe myself as pretty common-sense, practical kind of person who believes in making sure that you take care of your dollars. That's the way I was raised, that if you don't have the money for something you don't buy it now, you wait 'till you save up the money. So you need to have a strong fiscal platform and you also need to take care of people when they need help, and that's where I have done most of my work in my life. So I think it's providing that kind of balanced approach of a strong economy and strong social programs in our communities.

OP: Do you consider yourself a socialist?

JAMES: It's interesting, I don't label myself and I think people have tried to pick labels. They've tried to pick "socialist," they've tried to pick "Democrat" they've tried to pick "moderate...." I don't describe myself by labels and I don't think people out there describe themselves by labels.

OP: If, as you say, you are moderate, with moderate views on the issues, do you feel that your message is an any way compromised by your party's close relationship with organized Labor in this province?

Many of this province's biggest union bosses are quite openly socialists, and I think the fear
among many British Columbians is that even if Carol James herself is not a radical, she will ultimately
be beholden to the agenda of the far-left unions.

JAMES: It's interesting, I think you'll hear a lot of that kind of Liberal rhetoric out there, where people are suggesting that we're "beholden" to organized labor or otherwise. It's not surprising to me that working people are looking to New Democrats in this next election because working people have been hurt by this government. When you take a look at party donations for example, for New Democrats over 75% of the donations that come to our party come from individuals, less than 20% come from labor. If you look at the Liberals, over 75% of their donations come from corporations. But because that perception is there for people, one of the things that I've said is that we would actually commit to bringing in election financing reform, where you actually ban donations from corporations and unions because that perception is there, even if it's not true. It's a reality people still believe, that there are links there, for all political parties. So I'm saying let's address that issue to the public. Let's rebuild that trust in politics and political parties and we can do that by brining in election finance reform and banning corporate and union donations and leveling the playing field for everyone.

OP: Who are some politicians, past or present, living or dead, that you view as personal role models.

JAMES: Well, when I look at politicians what I look for is someone who has integrity and really lives their word. Who actually walks the talk. So modern day? I have a lot of respect for [NDP Premier] Gary Doer in Manitoba who's been able to invest strongly in healthcare and education, issues that matter to everyone in his province. And he's been able to increase the growth of his economy in his province and he has the resources for those programs, so that's someone who I have a lot of respect for.

One of my modern-day heroes is [former Ontariol NDP leader] Stephen Lewis. I have a lot of respect for Stephen Lewis, he's been able to take his advocacy to places that very few people have, around his drive to address the issue of poverty and AIDS, so I have a lot of respect for him.

And the Prime Minister of New Zealand, a woman, who came in after a very right-wing, conservative government in New Zealand who had moved to privatize basically everything in that country. Privatize education, privatize healthcare... and she came in and again, provided an opportunity to communities to have some say in what was going on in their community, so again that's another person that I have a lot of respect for.

OP: Obviously you have been very outspoken in your criticism of Premier Campbell during your tenure as leader. Is there anything his government has done that you admire or respect?

JAMES: It's pretty rare for the opposition leader to say that the government has done anything right. The only thing that I think has been interesting is the Citizen's Assembly. I think that was a very interesting idea to bring together citizens to look at our electoral process, and I think that's been a very exciting initiative, and I've been very supportive of it.

OP: Following on that note, the challenge of any NDP leader in this current political climate is to
convince British Columbians that the party has changed since the days of the Clark administration. That requires an admission that the party was wrong in the first place, however.
Do you, personally believe that Glen Clark was a bad premier?

JAMES: No. I think- and people have heard me say this before- New Democrats made mistakes when they were in government. We received a very clear message from the voters in the last election. We have learned from that message, and when I was elected leader I made a commitment to people that I would travel around British Columbia. I think our previous NDP governments didn't listen as well as they should have and my commitment to rebuild that trust was to spend the leadership convention traveling around British Columbia and listening to British Columbians. And that's what I did. I spent most of my time on the road for the past year going to small communities, meeting with groups and organizations, meeting with business, meeting with community leaders, meeting with activists, and showing them that New Democrats are going to be the government that is going to work with them and listen to them, because that's what's been missing under this government.

OP: Many Canadians, especially young Canadians who I talk to, seem to be in agreement that Canada is a nation in need of some serious constitutional reform. It's been suggested that Prime Minister Martin may
"re-open" the constitution for debate in the future. If you become Premier, that could thus become a key role you'd have to play, as that's how our federation works. What sort of constitutional changes would you press the Prime Minister for?

JAMES: It's interesting, because now you've piqued my interest, and I'll have to come back to it. I'll be honest, I've been focused on the province, we only have 70 plus days until the election so I've really been focused on the provincial issues and putting our campaign together so I haven't thought about constitutional issues. I've thought about federal issues, and where we can play a role as a province with the federal government, especially right now with the child care dollars coming down, and healthcare dollars coming down, we have a huge partnership there. But I haven't thought about federal constitutional issues. So you've piqued my interest, so I'll put some thought to it.

OP: How about on a BC level. I mean, as you've mentioned we have the Citizen's Assembly, and Premier Campbell has also brought in fixed election dates. Are there any sorts of constitutional, structural reforms at a BC level you're interested in?

JAMES: Well, I talked about the election financing reform, I think that's a big piece and that's certainly one of the pieces I'd like to see occur. I think fixed election dates are here to stay. I think there's been some discussion in the public about whether it should be moved to the fall, so it's after the auditor general has taken a look at the budget and I think that makes sense. But I think fixed election dates are here.

I've suggested that we actually bring in requirements around public advertising, government advertising with public dollars. I think we've seen one of the biggest wastes of taxpayer dollars in our history under Gordon Campbell and the Liberals with all the advertising they did, from the spring until December. So I said that I think we need to look at the previous auditor general's report and look at that and actually bring in requirements that say 'here's what you can use public dollars on advertising for, when it's a necessity in government' and the rest of the time you shouldn't be using our dollars for it. So that's another piece I think is important.

OP: The NDP has always been a party that has been passionately dedicated to resolving First Nations related issues such as land claims and the expansion of self-government and so forth. However, when I talk to many younger British Columbians, I find many are often frustrated that the government places so much emphasis on granting sweeping special rights to a minority who are defined sorely by race.

In the 21st Century, how do you justify these sorts of programs?

JAMES: I think it's a good example of where we need to do a better job of talking about our history as a province. In highschool I think we need to do a better job of talking about our aboriginal history. We're talking about a legal issue here, this isn't talking about giving special rights to a group of people because of race, this is talking about actually setting right a legal wrong, which is that we didn't settle treaties in this province. Other provinces went through the treaty process, whether it was a fair process or not is questionable. They did actually go through a process where they took land away from First Nations but they signed a treaty with them. That didn't occur in British Columbia, and so this isn't about giving special rights, this is actually about a legal requirement to ensure that we do what we need to do legally. We took land away and we need to settle those treaties and get on with it. That's good for all British Columbians, it's the right thing to do legally, it's the right thing to do morally, but it's also the right thing to do economically. Even the BC Business Council, which is interesting to look at, has come out with a report that said that we need to settle our treaties because we won't see good economic growth in British Columbia until those are settled because of the uncertainty around the land issues. So I'm saying get those settled, it's a necessity legally, it's a necessity morally, and it's also a necessity economically.

OP: Do you think that First Nations people will have a better life in the reserves, and will benefit more by continuing this treaty process than they would get as fully integrated citizens?

JAMES: I think it's up to First Nations. It's not up to us. It's up to them. When we settle the treaties what you'll find it's very interesting. If you go into the Terrace community, Terrace has really struggled, the forest industry went down, the mill went down, the community itself has really struggled. One of the key issues that has kept that community going economically has been the Nis'ga treaty, because when the Nis'ga treaty was settled the Nis'ga people had money from both federal and provincial governments that they used in their own economy in their communities. And so, although there's the Nis'ga treaty they spend their money in Terrace, they support the businesses in Terrace, they've helped the small businesses that have occurred, so its benefited all of the community. It hasn't just stayed within the reserve, it's in fact benefited the entire region in the northwest because those resources actually stay in the region, are spent in the region and are invested in the region. So it's been a boom. You talk to people who are non-First Nations in the Terrace area and they'll tell you the Nis'ga treaty has kept them going economically at a time when there was nothing else going on in their community.

OP: Lastly Leader James, what do you view as your single biggest challenge to overcome before the election in May.

JAMES: (long pause) Hmmm single biggest challenge? Time, probably (laughs). We only have 70 plus days to get the message out to make sure we reach out of all British Columbians. I think time is always short, but I've been incredibly pleased with how far we've been able to come in a year. I don't think anyone could have imagined New Democrats would be getting our message out to British Columbians and that people would be looking at us as a positive alternative in this upcoming election. So I think our biggest challenge is now continuing to take that message out for the next 70 plus days, working hard right up until May 17th and then voters make the decision.

OP: Thank you again for agreeing to this interview Leader James, it has been quite enlightening.

EPILOGUE:

On the March 17 election Carole James led the NDP to a surprisingly good showing. Though she was ultimately not elected Premier, she came close, with the NDP winning 33 of the parliament's 76 seats. The outcome greatly exceeded the predictions of all media pundits.